SID: So in other words what He said is when the leaders, the Sanhedrin, say “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord,” Jesus will be here. That’s quite a nuance; difference.

PAUL: Well, they disappeared. Here’s the exciting thing. And it’s happened right under the noses of most Bible believers, and they don’t even know it’s happened. At the end of 2004, 71 elders calling themselves the revived Sanhedrin approached the Knesset and said “We are now here. We’re back. We’re the rulers.” They disappeared for over 1,700 years. 1,700 years – No longer as a ruling body; and reappeared at the end of 2004.

SID: I don’t have to be a mental giant – you don’t have to be a mental giant to figure that out. They’re here now. They’re ready to say “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.” And Jesus will be here. Miracles: next segment. Trust me – don’t go away. Be right back after this. 

SID: Sid Roth here with Paul Wilbur, messianic Jewish psalmist. And it’s one thing when Paul goes to a nation like Zambia and sees miracles – which he did. Tumors drop off. But what happens when he’s just worshipping God in a church in Miami. What happens Paul?

PAUL: Well, there was a very spectacular presence of the living God. In Psalm 22:3, God promises, through King David, “I inhabit the praises of My people.” So if we will just put ourselves in an attitude of praise, He comes where we are. Now when we were in Miami, we were doing just that: A couple thousand Gypsies. These are Romanian immigrants that have come to the United States, they’ve got their own culture and language. And in about the second song, Sid, the Lord spoke to my heart and said “I don’t want to hear any more about My power. I want to demonstrate it now.” And that really kind of shook me, because I didn’t know what was going to happen. And then I understood that I should speak about healing, so I stopped the music. I told the people “The Lord is here to heal you.” and we had about four blind eyes and four or five deaf ears, in Miami, Florida, came open in a Sunday morning church service. The place just exploded.

SID: Listen. Paul Wilbur and his wife are quite a team. I just wish his wife, Luanne, would work on cue. She doesn’t. She can only speak when God speaks to her. But I was having dinner with Paul and all of a sudden, I see her go like this to his shoulder, and she starts speaking in an unknown language and he starts translating. Paul, you told me that you were talking to someone on the phone who had cancer, and what happened?

PAUL: They were healed. My wife and I were out to lunch. This is a good Presbyterian girl, you know, but God’s just gotten a hold of her. We were out to lunch, sitting by the beach, enjoying a nice afternoon, a friend of mine called. He said “We’re going to Milwaukee to have testing for cancer. I’ve been told I have this cancer and that cancer.” My wife pulled on my sleeve…

SID: I know that sign now.

PAUL: …And she had a message for him. I got the interpretation, declared to him that he’s healed, that the Lord is going to prove it to him. He called me two weeks later and said “I’m completely free. No cancer.” It’s just wonderful.

SID: Listen, that’s just wonderful for him, but what about you? Some of you are saying “What about me?” I believe, as Paul Wilbur sings from his new album, “Holy, Holy, Holy,” as you reach your heart up to God, miracles will break out. Get ready. Paul, go over there.

§ music §

Holy, holy, holy is the God of Israel Elders bow in worship as the angel voices swell Rain clouds of incense swirl around Your throne of grace Lord, we bow in worship at the brilliance of Your face We cry holy Holy Holy Is the Lord Holy Angels cry holy The Lord, He is holy Holy is the Lord You are the Lord’s There’s none like You, Lord Who is like You, oh Lord, among the gods? Holy, holy, holy is the song that heaven sings All creation praise Him, Hallelujah Elohim Come to reign forever, King Of Kings and Lord Of Lords Hill of Zion, open wide you ancient doors And cry holy Holy Holy is the Lord Holy Holy Holy is the Lord Of Lords Holy is the Lord, righteous and mighty Holy is the Lord Holy, holy The God who’s healing us You ever listen when we call You here Holy is the Lord

§ music § 

SID: The great Jewish prophet, Isaiah, caught a glimpse of God, and he said “Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord God Almighty. He’s high and lifted up, and His train fills the temple.” But then he says “Woe is me! I’m undone! I’ve seen the Lord.” And he recognized his sin. He recognized that all of his righteousness counted for nothing. Compared to another man it counted a great deal, but compared to God that he caught a glimpse of… God you’re so good. You’re so good. If you will turn from your sins, our good God will cover them with His blood. And He says, even more than cover, He will remove those sins in the name of Jesus. In the act of… Paul, God is telling you something.

PAUL: Yes. There’s someone listening to you right now, Sid, and they’re saying “I wish I knew that this was real.” And the Lord is going to confirm this to you, because you have tumors in your stomach; a lot of acid and a lot of discomfort. And the Lord is healing those right now as a sign to you that you are loved of God and can be saved. There’s someone else Sid that’s listening right now that has an issue of blood. There’s a loss of energy and a loss of vitality, and the doctors don’t know what to do; but there’s a leaking of blood somewhere internally in you that the doctors haven’t found, and the Lord is healing that for you right now because He loves you.

SID: Other miracles are happening right now too. Spines – they’re literally being repaired. Bend over, you’ll see there’s no pain in the neck, no pain in your neck, your back. And hip – if you’ll stand up and just jump, you’ll see that that pain is totally gone. This is your moment. What are you going to do about it? Are you going to say “Oh, I’ll just look at something else on TV”? Or are you going to have an encounter with the Living God? Choose this day whom you shall serve, but as for me and my house, we’re going to serve the Living God. I want you to be part of the mishpochah; that’s a Hebrew word, it means ‘family’. I want you part of God’s family. Why would you want to walk around like a blind man, when you can see? In Jesus’ name, repent to your sins, and believe that He is your Lord. Ask Him to forgive your sins and live inside of you. 

SID: So in other words what He said is when the leaders, the Sanhedrin, say “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord,” Jesus will be here. That’s quite a nuance; difference.

PAUL: Well, they disappeared. Here’s the exciting thing. And it’s happened right under the noses of most Bible believers, and they don’t even know it’s happened. At the end of 2004, 71 elders calling themselves the revived Sanhedrin approached the Knesset and said “We are now here. We’re back. We’re the rulers.” They disappeared for over 1,700 years. 1,700 years – No longer as a ruling body; and reappeared at the end of 2004.

SID: I don’t have to be a mental giant – you don’t have to be a mental giant to figure that out. They’re here now. They’re ready to say “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.” And Jesus will be here. Miracles: next segment. Trust me – don’t go away. Be right back after this. 

SID: Sid Roth here with Paul Wilbur, messianic Jewish psalmist. And it’s one thing when Paul goes to a nation like Zambia and sees miracles – which he did. Tumors drop off. But what happens when he’s just worshipping God in a church in Miami. What happens Paul?

PAUL: Well, there was a very spectacular presence of the living God. In Psalm 22:3, God promises, through King David, “I inhabit the praises of My people.” So if we will just put ourselves in an attitude of praise, He comes where we are. Now when we were in Miami, we were doing just that: A couple thousand Gypsies. These are Romanian immigrants that have come to the United States, they’ve got their own culture and language. And in about the second song, Sid, the Lord spoke to my heart and said “I don’t want to hear any more about My power. I want to demonstrate it now.” And that really kind of shook me, because I didn’t know what was going to happen. And then I understood that I should speak about healing, so I stopped the music. I told the people “The Lord is here to heal you.” and we had about four blind eyes and four or five deaf ears, in Miami, Florida, came open in a Sunday morning church service. The place just exploded.

SID: Listen. Paul Wilbur and his wife are quite a team. I just wish his wife, Luanne, would work on cue. She doesn’t. She can only speak when God speaks to her. But I was having dinner with Paul and all of a sudden, I see her go like this to his shoulder, and she starts speaking in an unknown language and he starts translating. Paul, you told me that you were talking to someone on the phone who had cancer, and what happened?

PAUL: They were healed. My wife and I were out to lunch. This is a good Presbyterian girl, you know, but God’s just gotten a hold of her. We were out to lunch, sitting by the beach, enjoying a nice afternoon, a friend of mine called. He said “We’re going to Milwaukee to have testing for cancer. I’ve been told I have this cancer and that cancer.” My wife pulled on my sleeve…

SID: I know that sign now.

PAUL: …And she had a message for him. I got the interpretation, declared to him that he’s healed, that the Lord is going to prove it to him. He called me two weeks later and said “I’m completely free. No cancer.” It’s just wonderful.

SID: Listen, that’s just wonderful for him, but what about you? Some of you are saying “What about me?” I believe, as Paul Wilbur sings from his new album, “Holy, Holy, Holy,” as you reach your heart up to God, miracles will break out. Get ready. Paul, go over there.

§ music §

Holy, holy, holy is the God of Israel Elders bow in worship as the angel voices swell Rain clouds of incense swirl around Your throne of grace Lord, we bow in worship at the brilliance of Your face We cry holy Holy Holy Is the Lord Holy Angels cry holy The Lord, He is holy Holy is the Lord You are the Lord’s There’s none like You, Lord Who is like You, oh Lord, among the gods? Holy, holy, holy is the song that heaven sings All creation praise Him, Hallelujah Elohim Come to reign forever, King Of Kings and Lord Of Lords Hill of Zion, open wide you ancient doors And cry holy Holy Holy is the Lord Holy Holy Holy is the Lord Of Lords Holy is the Lord, righteous and mighty Holy is the Lord Holy, holy The God who’s healing us You ever listen when we call You here Holy is the Lord

SID: The great Jewish prophet, Isaiah, caught a glimpse of God, and he said “Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord God Almighty. He’s high and lifted up, and His train fills the temple.” But then he says “Woe is me! I’m undone! I’ve seen the Lord.” And he recognized his sin. He recognized that all of his righteousness counted for nothing. Compared to another man it counted a great deal, but compared to God that he caught a glimpse of… God you’re so good. You’re so good. If you will turn from your sins, our good God will cover them with His blood. And He says, even more than cover, He will remove those sins in the name of Jesus. In the act of… Paul, God is telling you something.

PAUL: Yes. There’s someone listening to you right now, Sid, and they’re saying “I wish I knew that this was real.” And the Lord is going to confirm this to you, because you have tumors in your stomach; a lot of acid and a lot of discomfort. And the Lord is healing those right now as a sign to you that you are loved of God and can be saved. There’s someone else Sid that’s listening right now that has an issue of blood. There’s a loss of energy and a loss of vitality, and the doctors don’t know what to do; but there’s a leaking of blood somewhere internally in you that the doctors haven’t found, and the Lord is healing that for you right now because He loves you.

SID: Other miracles are happening right now too. Spines – they’re literally being repaired. Bend over, you’ll see there’s no pain in the neck, no pain in your neck, your back. And hip – if you’ll stand up and just jump, you’ll see that that pain is totally gone. This is your moment. What are you going to do about it? Are you going to say “Oh, I’ll just look at something else on TV”? Or are you going to have an encounter with the Living God? Choose this day whom you shall serve, but as for me and my house, we’re going to serve the Living God. I want you to be part of the mishpochah; that’s a Hebrew word, it means ‘family’. I want you part of God’s family. Why would you want to walk around like a blind man, when you can see? In Jesus’ name, repent to your sins, and believe that He is your Lord. Ask Him to forgive your sins and live inside of you.

SID: Sid Roth here with Paul Wilbur. Paul is not a worship leader, he is a new covenant prophetic psalmist. And you said, Paul, that God had shown you that this is a year of breakthrough. What does that mean to you?

PAUL: Its bars of iron that are cut; its double doors of bronze that have been closed to us before; new opportunities to share the goodness of God. Later on this year, I’ll take a large team with me to Zambia in Africa, at the invitation of the President.

PAUL: Now you were recently in Zambia, and they had…

SID: You’re talking about breakthroughs. They had breakthroughs.

PAUL: They did. In fact, while we were there, the Vice-President of the nation receive Yeshua – received Jesus as his Lord and Savior. So for that nation, you know, as the head goes, so goes the rest of the body. I’m very excited for Zambia, because they are lining themselves up now for the blessings of God.

SID: Tell me about the country. How bad off are they?

PAUL: It’s exceptionally bad. They are the second or third poorest nation in the world, perhaps behind Ethiopia and Sudan. The average Zambian does not make it to their 40th birthday. They have the second highest incidence of AIDS. One-tenth; over one-tenth,

SID. If you think about this, over one-tenth of their population are orphans that live on the streets. We fed some of these children. The most fortunate of them get one bowl of porridge from a caring church, a congregation there in the nation, one time a day, and most of the time just five days a week. But most of those children go to bed hungry; begging on streets, living in garbage traps. The poverty is staggering. And I found out, one of the reasons for the great turnaround, when this nation became a nation back in 1972, the first thing their first president did was sever diplomatic relations with Israel – His first act as president.

SID: My goodness. Now we know Genesis 12:3, God says “I’ll bless those who bless the Jewish people, I’ll curse those who curse them.” I mean this is a graphic illustration of that.

PAUL: Absolutely. Now they have, for the last two presidents, including this one, they’re born-again Christians. They have reestablished diplomatic relationships with Israel and declared that Zambia is a Christian nation. They’ve dedicated the nation to the Lord. Imagine if our President did that: Stood up at a State of the Union address and said “I’m dedicating the United States to the Lord.”

SID: You told me what happened to a Muslim mosque in Zambia. What happened?

PAUL: Phenomenal. Now isn’t it wonderful, that when we do just what God shows us to do, He adds the power to it. If we lay hands on the sick like He says, people get healed. Well, the Bible says to take care of orphans and widows in their distress, and Zambia has more than their share.

SID: Of course.

PAUL: So this young messianic believer went out to feed street children one day, and he set up his shop right next to a Muslim mosque. And from the safety of the mosque, the imam – the pastor or the rabbi if you will – was watching, and he was very curious as to why these people fed everybody. They fed Muslims, they fed Christians, they fed children, they fed anybody who was hungry. And finally the imam couldn’t take it any longer. He walked out… Now I heard this first-hand from the man. This is almost too hard to believe, but it’s so good. He walked out to talk with this young messianic believer, and he said “I’ve just got to know, why do you feed everybody? We Muslims, we only feed our people.” And so this young man shared the love of God and some scripture with him. The imam repented right there, received Jesus as Lord of his life. Then, the next day, called a meeting for his entire mosque. Five hundred showed up. He’s one day old in the Lord. He gave his testimony, and over two hundred of those people received the Lord, went down to the crocodile-infested river – this separates the men from the boys. If you’re going to get a mikvah and there’s crocodiles watching, this means you’re serious. And over two hundred of them were baptized or mikvahed that day. And they went up and took the crescent off the top of the mosque and put a star of David on the side.

SID: Could you picture, if ever mosque in, say, London, England, that happened to? Do you know there are more mosques in London, England today than churches? Could you picture if that happened in the United States and in Europe? Paul, there’s something going on with Israel. There’s something new going on. I think it’s got to do with that word breakthrough that you used. What is going on that you see in this area?

PAUL: Well, there’s a new desire, there’s a fresh hunger, I believe, for the presence of God, and for knowing who is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Remember, Esther said that she was brought to the kingdom… Or Mordecai said to her “You’ve been brought to the kingdom for such a time as this.” I believe that a lot of Israelis are wondering “What time is it?” They hear a lot in Christian broadcasting, and from the many tourists that come through. But something happened at the end of 2004, Sid, which also puts it… In Matthew 23, Yeshua said to Jerusalem “You’ll not see Me again until you say ‘Blessed is he who comes.’” Now was He speaking to all Israel? Certainly He was. Was He speaking just to Jerusalem? Well, no. If you read it carefully, He says “I wanted to gather your chicks together, but you were not willing, and you will not see Me again until you say…” See, I believe He was speaking directly to the leaders, the 71 elders, the Sanhedrin, the Pharisees, and the Sadducees. 

SID: Sid Roth here with Paul Wilbur. Paul is not a worship leader, he is a new covenant prophetic psalmist. And you said, Paul, that God had shown you that this is a year of breakthrough. What does that mean to you?

PAUL: Its bars of iron that are cut; its double doors of bronze that have been closed to us before; new opportunities to share the goodness of God. Later on this year, I’ll take a large team with me to Zambia in Africa, at the invitation of the President.

PAUL: Now you were recently in Zambia, and they had…

SID: You’re talking about breakthroughs. They had breakthroughs.

PAUL: They did. In fact, while we were there, the Vice-President of the nation receive Yeshua – received Jesus as his Lord and Savior. So for that nation, you know, as the head goes, so goes the rest of the body. I’m very excited for Zambia, because they are lining themselves up now for the blessings of God.

SID: Tell me about the country. How bad off are they?

PAUL: It’s exceptionally bad. They are the second or third poorest nation in the world, perhaps behind Ethiopia and Sudan. The average Zambian does not make it to their 40th birthday. They have the second highest incidence of AIDS. One-tenth; over one-tenth,

SID. If you think about this, over one-tenth of their population are orphans that live on the streets. We fed some of these children. The most fortunate of them get one bowl of porridge from a caring church, a congregation there in the nation, one time a day, and most of the time just five days a week. But most of those children go to bed hungry; begging on streets, living in garbage traps. The poverty is staggering. And I found out, one of the reasons for the great turnaround, when this nation became a nation back in 1972, the first thing their first president did was sever diplomatic relations with Israel – His first act as president.

SID: My goodness. Now we know Genesis 12:3, God says “I’ll bless those who bless the Jewish people, I’ll curse those who curse them.” I mean this is a graphic illustration of that.

PAUL: Absolutely. Now they have, for the last two presidents, including this one, they’re born-again Christians. They have reestablished diplomatic relationships with Israel and declared that Zambia is a Christian nation. They’ve dedicated the nation to the Lord. Imagine if our President did that: Stood up at a State of the Union address and said “I’m dedicating the United States to the Lord.”

SID: You told me what happened to a Muslim mosque in Zambia. What happened?

PAUL: Phenomenal. Now isn’t it wonderful, that when we do just what God shows us to do, He adds the power to it. If we lay hands on the sick like He says, people get healed. Well, the Bible says to take care of orphans and widows in their distress, and Zambia has more than their share.

SID: Of course.

PAUL: So this young messianic believer went out to feed street children one day, and he set up his shop right next to a Muslim mosque. And from the safety of the mosque, the imam – the pastor or the rabbi if you will – was watching, and he was very curious as to why these people fed everybody. They fed Muslims, they fed Christians, they fed children, they fed anybody who was hungry. And finally the imam couldn’t take it any longer. He walked out… Now I heard this first-hand from the man. This is almost too hard to believe, but it’s so good. He walked out to talk with this young messianic believer, and he said “I’ve just got to know, why do you feed everybody? We Muslims, we only feed our people.” And so this young man shared the love of God and some scripture with him. The imam repented right there, received Jesus as Lord of his life. Then, the next day, called a meeting for his entire mosque. Five hundred showed up. He’s one day old in the Lord. He gave his testimony, and over two hundred of those people received the Lord, went down to the crocodile-infested river – this separates the men from the boys. If you’re going to get a mikvah and there’s crocodiles watching, this means you’re serious. And over two hundred of them were baptized or mikvahed that day. And they went up and took the crescent off the top of the mosque and put a star of David on the side.

SID: Could you picture, if ever mosque in, say, London, England, that happened to? Do you know there are more mosques in London, England today than churches? Could you picture if that happened in the United States and in Europe? Paul, there’s something going on with Israel. There’s something new going on. I think it’s got to do with that word breakthrough that you used. What is going on that you see in this area?

PAUL: Well, there’s a new desire, there’s a fresh hunger, I believe, for the presence of God, and for knowing who is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Remember, Esther said that she was brought to the kingdom… Or Mordecai said to her “You’ve been brought to the kingdom for such a time as this.” I believe that a lot of Israelis are wondering “What time is it?” They hear a lot in Christian broadcasting, and from the many tourists that come through. But something happened at the end of 2004, Sid, which also puts it… In Matthew 23, Yeshua said to Jerusalem “You’ll not see Me again until you say ‘Blessed is he who comes.’” Now was He speaking to all Israel? Certainly He was. Was He speaking just to Jerusalem? Well, no. If you read it carefully, He says “I wanted to gather your chicks together, but you were not willing, and you will not see Me again until you say…” See, I believe He was speaking directly to the leaders, the 71 elders, the Sanhedrin, the Pharisees, and the Sadducees.

SID: Sid Roth here with messianic Jewish psalmist Paul Wilbur. The job, if you will, of a psalmist is so misunderstood, and the only way you can understand what a psalmist is, is to look at the Jewish scriptures. What is a psalmist, Paul?

PAUL: I believe the best definition of a psalmist, Sid, would be for a cantor today; someone who hears the voice of God and gives it voice into the earth. Now that could be a restating of something written by King David, or one of the prophets, that has an application for today. But those of us who lead worship, and I’m not a song leader, I lead worship, or lead worshippers, I believe our highest calling is as watchmen – to hear what others cannot hear, see what others cannot see, and then give it voice into the earth. So a psalmist really is a prophetic ministry.

SID: Speaking of a prophetic ministry, you’re a prophet. What do you see happening this year?

PAUL: A lot of people are declaring a lot of things. Brother Hagin declared, before he graduated from this earth, that the last quarter of last year and this entire year was to be a year of unprecedented glory. That is the manifest presence of God. I really reverberate with that in my spirit. I’ve been with other notable men and women of God that are declaring that this is a year for unprecedented supernatural things in the earth. This year as I was praying – the end of last year and the beginning of this year – the word the Lord gave me was “breakthrough.” I believe this is a year for breakthrough. Isaiah 45, one of the prophets of Israel, Isaiah, said that the anointed of the Lord, God would take him by the hand. You cannot miss it, when God takes you by the hand like a father to lead you across a street or take you where you need to go. And then he said “I will cut down bars of iron before you. I will open double doors – double doors.” The blessing this year, I believe, Sid, is going to be so large that it won’t be able to pass through a single door. It’s going to have to be double doors. And then he said “I will also give you secrets; treasures hidden in secret places.”

SID: You know, when you say treasures hidden in secret places, many people in their mind think in terms of money. But you know what I’m thinking of? In terms of ancient Jewish anointings that are going to be released. Now you have a new CD that we’re making available called “The Watchman.” I’ve known you many years, and this has, without a doubt, the strongest presence of God on it, out of anything that you’ve ever done. Tell me about this first song that we’re going to have you sing.

PAUL: This first song I co-wrote with some friends, and it’s a reaction song. We call it “Adonai.” And the reason I say it’s a reaction song, I just got so disturbed, or moved, in my heart because today we keep hearing about Islam being a peaceful religion. We hear about this one god. You know, there are three great world religions. There is the kingdom of God and then there’s everything else as far as I’m concerned. And I was so disturbed about hearing “Allah is god, he has no son.” We wanted to create a song that declares “The Lord, He is God.” Like the prophet said on the top of Mount Carmel, “Choose this day whom you’re going to serve, but the Lord…” Is it the Lord or is it these other gods? And when Israel decided to follow God, then all of the goodness broke out. So this song is a declaration song: The Lord, there is no one but Him. The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. His son… Interesting Sid, that that beautiful gold dome that we see in Jerusalem; everybody equates it with Jerusalem; is a Muslim mosque. And around the top of it in Arabic, it declares “Allah is god and he has no equal. He has no son.”

SID: You know, his song, Adonai, when Paul sings it, he sings ancient Hebrew words: Baruch HaShem Adonai: Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord. He is declaring that when the Jewish people say blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord, open your eyes: Messiah is going to be here.

SID: Sid Roth here with Joan Hunter, what happens after 25 years of marriage to a minister, four beautiful daughters, and the minister says I’m in love with another man, and he’s homosexual and the marriage is done. The Hunters are devastated, well Joan Hunter was in that situation and when we took the break I said what about those four girls, and she said I gave them to God. Well Joan, what did you do when perhaps one of your daughters showed all sorts of challenges, you gave them to God, but what did you do, give me an exact instance. 

JOAN: Well they would call and tell me a situation that had happened, and in the natural I wouldn’t have approved of, and they knew better. And instead of going “Now you know better than that,” because that is the worst thing you can do, they need to know your unconditional love, and you love them with the love of the Lord. And in the conversation or whatever, I’d get off the phone and I’d say God, do you see what your daughter is doing, do you hear what your daughter just did? That’s when you know that you have given them to God. And all four of their lives have dramatically turned around. And it’s wonderful.  

SID: Joan, and I promised you by the way, Joan walks in such power, she worked for, how many years with your parents? 

JOAN: Off and on, I still actually do a few meetings for them a year, help them.  

SID: Okay, a lifetime. 

JOAN: Over thirty years. 

SID: Working with a ministry that has seen more miracles than any ministry I know of, boy does she have faith. We had so many miracles happen last time Joan was here, you have got to tell me the story about the 88 year old woman with fibromyalgia, how long did she suffer? She, I asked, does anybody have fibromyalgia, she said yes, and I said how long have you had it and she says her whole life. And I said, I’m thinking in the natural there is no way she could have had it her whole life, she says I don’t remember not having it. And I said well usually fibromyalgia is brought on by a traumatic experience, she said well my brother was shot when I was three, and I thought okay, that will bring it on, that’s for sure.  

SID: But what could she do about it? 

JOAN: And so in talking to her and praying with her and ministering to her, I talked to her about the situation, it turned out that her, I think it was her 11 year old brother had a buddy and the buddy got mad, and the buddy went home got a gun and came back and shot him point blank right in front of her, and for 30 years, I’m sorry, for 85 years she had walked in unforgiveness, 85 years, not only that but had walked in pain, had nightmares every night, every night, tormenting her for 85 years. And I ministered to her and I said, I said, you know you need to forgive him, and so we did, you know, we went through the forgiveness process, and I mean it was as if her face was all wrinkled at 88 and as God, as she forgave him, she looked like 50, just like that. And I said I didn’t ever pray for fibromyalgia, I said how do you feel because fibromyalgia you are just in pain everywhere, she said I’m healed. And that was Saturday morning and by Sunday night, I mean each service, and I was there for several services, each service people would go in, she didn’t even look the same, she absolutely got a total complete makeover, a facelift and everything and she is doing great. And she said if I had only known it had been that simple.  

SID: It is that simple. There is going to be a power encounter that you are going to see, a demonstration of the Living God, are you ready? Just before Joan prays I heard that there is someone with your right leg and you have a pain, it’s the upper part of the leg, you have a pain there, I tell you it is gone. In Yeshua, that’s Hebrew for Jesus, In Yeshua’s name. Joan, would you pray for people, especially for those who are having problems with marriages, problems with children, please pray for them.  

JOAN: Okay, what we need to do and you heard me mention just a few minutes ago about laying your children on the altar, and the same things goes with your mom, your dad, your spouse, your job, your boss, your brother, your sister, whatever it is,  

SID: Listen, the whole modulo, the whole everything  

JOAN: The whole kit and caboodle, and what happens is if you pick them back up off the altar you’ll start feeling pains in your neck and your shoulders, and those are just signs, oh I’ve picked up the worry of finances again, you know, Father I lay my finances on your altar. And it’s very important to do that, and just repeat after me, and after the program you will have time to do this more, and go through a list of people and just say Father, I lay my daughter, and then say their name, on the altar, I give her to you, I repent for trying to do your job and the job of the Holy Spirit and Father I give her to you in Jesus name. And then like women, you know, just repeat after me, Father, I lay my husband on the altar, Father, I lay my husband on the altar, Father I lay my husband on the altar, it usually takes about eight times for the women to finally do it for the first time, and just say Father I lay my husband on the altar, I’ve tried to make him into the Godly man that I want him to be, but Father, I release him to you, I’ll be the best wife that I know and to love him unconditionally, but Father, I release him to you. And you can tell when you pick him back up because when you start to hurt here and there and it’s like, and things aren’t going really well, and it’s amazing, because people will say I laid my husband on the altar and he completely changed, no, what changed is your attitude toward your husband because it is not your job to fix him, it’s God’s job to fix him.

 SID: In other words, we do our job and god does his. 

JOAN: And let him do his. 

SID: It’s so simple you need help to get confused, Joan. 

JOAN: Yes, I know that and we try to make it hard, it’s like with healing, and people say well you pray for somebody and in a minute they are healed, well the Bible says that you are to lay hands on the sick and see them recover, comma, and it doesn’t take longer than that to see them recover, you are going to cast out devils in my name, comma,

 SID: We only have a few seconds, look in the camera and pray especially for spines right now.  

JOAN: Okay, father right now in the name of Jesus I send the word of healing in Jesus name, I command those spines to line up in Jesus name, I command the deterioration of that spine to be reversed, I speak an entire new spine in Jesus name, I course the breast cancer, the prostate cancer, any cancer in any body that is watching right now in Jesus name. Father I thank you for the kneecap that was replaced the last time I was on, but Father there is more knees that need to be replaced in Jesus name, I speak a new rotator cup in Jesus name, new wrists, carpal tunnel is cursed in Jesus name, arthritis is cursed in Jesus name, Father I thank you the upset stomach,  

SID: It’s done, it’s done, it’s finished,  

JOAN: In Jesus name, amen.

SID: Sid Roth here with Joan Hunter, put yourself in this situation, married 25 years to a pastor, four beautiful daughters, and one day your husband says, I am going to leave you for another man, devastation, hurt, shame, Joan, you handled it, I’ so pleased, but what about those four girls, they’re devastating, I mean you know they are devastated, you hurt for them more than they are hurting, but they are hurting, what did you do? 

JOAN: They didn’t understand, I mean they are just so hurt, and here is their, you know, their father preaching from the pulpit that it is wrong and yet the deception that he had actually been doing it all along. And that was harder than everything else. 

SID: How does someone, curiosity, when someone is involved in sin, how are they preaching that it’s wrong, what is going on inside, is it that the heart is so deceived? 

JOAN: Yes, that is one of the things, and he, it’s selfish, and its just flesh, it is driven by selfish flesh. And one of the things he said in the process of divorce, he said, “What can I say, I have just been a very good actor for all these years.” you know, acting in the pulpit, acting at home, acting in the marriage, and you know and things like that, and you know it was a good act, you know I mean he would have won the academy award with no problem on that one. 

SID: Okay, all right, the girls, tell me about them, what’s going on with them? 

JOAN: Okay, three of them are married now, and one of them is waiting for the best husband in the world, and

SID: Now take me back to right after the devastation. 

JOAN: The, we would, at the house we would just, they would get home from school    and we would just cry you know and that’s all that we could do, I mean we lost, we had to move out of our house and move into a really small house as in comparison to what I could afford and what he could afford, and it was just unbelievable  

SID: Did they, but the way, she also came down with cancer, did they know you had this cancer? 

JOAN: No. 

SID: Was it life-threatening cancer? 

JOAN: It could have been, I mean if you don’t get healed of it, yeah, for sure, but God healed me of it.  

SID: Okay, so what did you do with your children, did you send them to counseling, did you, how do you, Jewish people call it, make them (Jewish word)  

JOAN: We couldn’t send them to the pastor cause that was the Dad you know, and then, even six years ago, even today people, the average person has no idea how to deal with somebody, whether it had been me or whether it had been the children, how do you deal with somebody like that, what can I say to help you? They don’t need counseling from friends, they just need to know your love, tell them that you love them, tell them that you are praying for them, don’t try to correct it.  

SID: Fine and good, but what did you do, I want to know what you did because there are a lot of people watching right now that have problems with their children, maybe not in such a devastating circumstance as Joan had, but you’ve got some real problems between children and parents, what did you do so they can do it?  

JOAN: I tried to fix them, I tried to make them well, I tried to get them healed, I did everything I knew to do, especially having been in the ministry for so long, I did everything to fix my children, and you know and say, now you know better, you are not supposed to do this, well what did that do, it brought rebellion like you have never seen, I mean I’m just like, everything that I said you need to do this or stop doing this, it just caused the adverse effect, and I mean it just kept getting worse and worse and worse, and a lot of the things they were doing they were just doing to cover up their pain, and so I said, God, what am I going to do, I can’t fix them? He goes, dud, you know in so many words, it was just like okay now are you going to let me take care of them? And I said God, I repent for trying to do your job, I know you and the Holy spirit can do a whole lot better than me, I give You my children, I lay them on Your altar, and I said Father I lay charity on Your altar, she’s Yours. And then I’d say Father I lay Spice on Your altar, and I would say Melody, and then Abigail, and I said God, they are Yours. The more I try to do, the more I try to do as a Mother, as a minister, it just caused adverse reaction, I mean really bad adverse reaction, and I gave them to God.

 SID: Joan, that sounds too simple, it sounds too simple. 

JOAN: Well, it’s not a one-time thing, I’ll tell you that, cause then situations happen, and all of a sudden if you start feeling pain in your neck, in your shoulders, more than likely you’ve picked them back up, because if you’ve got a child that weighs say 130, 200 pounds, depending on the child  

SID: But you told me the bottom line, they’re (Hebrew word) today. As Joan was speaking, God began to speak to me, there are going to be such physical healings when we come back, I have been interviewing people that have demonstrated miracles for, close to thirty years now, I have never had so many reports and letters of people being physically healed as I did the last time Joan Hunter was my guest, don’t go away.

SID: You know I can’t think of anything worse, you are married 25 years, you have four beautiful daughters, and then you find out that your husband is having a homosexual affair. Joan Hunter, I mean, you lived it, that is just the most, I mean you have got your children, you’ve got, did you love your husband? 

JOAN: Oh yes, and one of the most difficult things to do was to go through a divorce still loving the person you are divorcing, that was very difficult. And in addition to that, we were pastoring a church. 

SID: That, that make it a lot more complex, how did the church react? 

JOAN: it was very devastating on them too; I mean they had lost their best friend, their pastor, they, you deal with deception, you feel, you know a lot of them feel they just can’t trust a pastor. 

SID: Did he go into counseling to get rid of this problem, or? 

JOAN: No, because he didn’t consider it a problem, he just considered that that was just the way that he was. 

SID: Wait a second now, he’s a pastor, it says in the Bible that those that are homosexual don’t go to Heaven, that’s not my opinion, that’s what the Bible says. 

JOAN: And I totally agree with you on that and, but the common comment is grace. Now I know that God, you know, has a lot of grace, that’s for sure, but I call that, you know I just call it a grace abuser, you know and just trying to push way beyond what is really in the Bible. And you know when you have a situation like that and it comes up, you know it just talks about a variety of things, of reasons that will keep people from Heaven, and, but when you are living in it, and you tend to just ignore that. 

SID: Did you lose your faith in God when this occurred? 

JOAN: Many times people have asked me, “How long did it take you to come back to the Lord after that?” I got saved when I was twelve, I’ve never left. 

SID: And for those that are not familiar with Joan Hunter, her parents are know affectionately as “The Happy Hunters,” Charles and Frances Hunter, they have probably witnessed more miracles that any person in this generation on earth, and Joan, you grew up in that ministry, you witnessed all those miracles, so when you saw all those miracles, why didn’t you just say, “Well, God, just heal my husband?” and why wasn’t he healed? 

JOAN: Well, when you find out you just don’t always just okay forget it, this is over, but after praying and interceding and you know, standing and believing and counseling and different situations, realistically for many years when I thought there was a problem, but then when he realized, or you know, made a decision that that was what he wanted to be, that’s when I released him. 

SID: Okay, you’re divorced, you have four children, I assume the children are pretty devastated too? 

JOAN: At that time yes they were, that was many, many years ago at this point. 

SID: You actually got sick on top of all of that. 

JOAN: I was divorced on Tuesday, which in itself is extremely devastating, after 25 years, you know you are co-dependent, you know you are twenty years old when you get married, you don’t know anything but that, and you know have to go to court, and divorce, and I was sobbing, they almost had to postpone the divorce because I couldn’t even answer yes or no because of the tears, because it just about killed me, and then the following Thursday I was diagnosed with breast cancer in my left breast. 

SID: How can one person handle all of this, how could you Joan? 

JOAN: God, you know I had to make the decision to go, I mean, you know realistically here I was dying in my heart and then I was dying in my body, I had a great opportunity to check out, and the doctor said I was 

SID: What about those four girls? 

JOAN: If it wasn’t for them I know I wouldn’t be here today. 

SID: So, all right, how serious was your cancer? 

JOAN: God healed me very quickly, and because of the healing in my heart, getting divorced, having to, because worry will bring on sickness, unforgiveness will bring on sickness, and different things like, that, and I believe that that’s what opened the door you know to my sickness, and when I walked forgiveness, when I got rid of bitterness, when I got rid of the worry of what is he doing, while I’m at work, what is he doing, who is he with, and those different situations you know you try to trust but you know otherwise, and when I got rid of all of that, within, very, very quickly my breast cancer left. 

SID: I know you can’t answer this but I’m going to put the question to you anyway, what percentage of people that have illness would probably receive their physical healing if their heart was healed?

 JOAN: I would say 100 percent realistically, but about my estimate in the natural, is about 85 percent of all diseases are brought on through some kind of stress, not being able to handle stress correctly, like worry, depression, hopelessness, all that kind of stuff, it, you shut down emotionally, and so your body starts to shut down like the immune system, it just starts to shut down.  

SID: I have to ask this question, how does someone forgive, you know what I have   found, when you love someone and they wound you, in the natural now, your love turns to hurt and then to hate and then even some, to murder, how did you stop that progression or are you still dealing with it? 

JOAN: Well the latter part, I know that God did not call me to a prison ministry so, so   we just stopped way short of there, no, you just want to go “errrrr” you know, because not just for devastation for me, but the effect that it had on the children, like you can mess with me but don’t mess with my children. 

SID: I understand, I got that. 

JOAN: Don’t mess with your daughter, you know, and so that was hardest, that was hard, you know I knew that I would go on, and I would survive, but when I saw the devastation of the children, that was the hardest part for me to forgive. 

SID: Have you had occasion, now it’s how many years ago? 

JOAN: Over six years. 

SID: Okay, in this six years have you had occasion to bump into your ex-husband at a social event?

JOAN: Weddings, yeah, two weddings and 

SID: All right, when you bump into him at a wedding of all things, 

JOAN: Our daughter’s wedding, our daughter is graduating from med school in a couple of months, and 

SID: Okay, now between the two of us, is there some churning that goes on inside, is there some hurt that goes on inside, is there some unforgiveness, unresolved things that goes on inside of you? 

JOAN: I can honestly say no. 

SID: How could you do that? Tell me your secret. 

JOAN: God has just so freed me, He’s healed my heart. 

SID: I mean the Bible says, wait a second, the Bible says we must forgive, we understand that, but to forgive in all of our human side, our emotions, the bubbling over, the blood pressure, the you name it, how do you, how did you do it? 

JOAN: The you name it, it’s the difference between, you know if I were to give you this cup and yet pull it back, the difference to really giving it to God and letting God deal with it, none of us truly forgive, none of us truly deserve forgiveness, but be the grace of God. And unforgiveness is a poison that we drink hoping that the other one will get sick. Now if I held it against him, it wouldn’t affect him at all, it would only start killing me, and when I 

SID: You know that is so profound, would you say that again. 

JOAN: Unforgiveness is the poison that we drink hoping that the other one will get sick, and if I did not forgive him it wouldn’t make any difference to him, I’m the one that would be affected. 

SID: How about you, where do you stand on forgiveness, who has wounded you? I mean if I had x-ray vision and could come right into your home right now, I would see your heart, and when the Bible refers to the heart it’s your spirit, and I would see scars there, how would you like to get rid of those scars? How would you like to be free? Don’t go away, I want to find out what happened to these four daughters that were involved in this. I mean could you picture the shame going on? We’ll be right back after this word.

SID: Hello. Sid Roth here. Welcome to my world where it’s naturally supernatural. My guest, Delores Winder, had what I believe is one of the greatest verifiable miracles that I’ve ever observed. You may wonder what’s over here. This is a neck brace that she lived in. This is a body brace that she lived in. Delores, how long did you live in this?

DELORES: Well I lived in plaster of Paris ones for seven years. They would cut the size open and put straps on it, and then finally they started making plastic, and I lived in plastic ones for another seven and a half years.

SID: What is this bump here on the back?

DELORES: That’s where the bone came through the skin and was stuck out, and I had to wear a patch on that to keep it from happening.

SID: Okay. Some of you perhaps have never heard of Kathryn Kuhlman. I was privileged as a brand new Jewish believer in the Messiah to see her in the auditoriums, and she had such a relationship with the Holy Spirit that she lived for that relationship. And the greatest miracles I ever saw in my life happened there. But the greatest miracle that I know of that happened under her ministry is my guest, Delores Winder. And I want to take you back in time, and I want you to see this miracle taking place right now. Take a look.

Delores (video): I was in body cast for 14 years. Four fusions: one through the front, the other three through the back, two cordotomies to kill the pain. So this side of my body was numb from here down, this side from here down. Two weeks before I was healed my husband and I made my funeral arrangements.

SID: What you’re about ready to have unwind is going to build your belief in God, your belief in the miraculous. Delores, for those that don’t understand, you had a disease that your bones were becoming brittle way before their time.

DELORES: Yes.

SID: And when someone reaches a point that they’re about ready to die, they’re terminal and their pain is unbearable, they had a surgery back then, which they don’t even do today.

DELORES: No.

SID: It’s such a horrific surgery. What was it and what did they do?

DELORES: It was called percutaneous cordotomy where they go into the base of the brain through behind the ear and they burn out the nerve centers so you can never feel again in the part of the body that they burn the nerve centers out.

SID: Now you had it on both sides.

DELORES: Yes.

SID: Which meant that you had no feeling from where, your waist down?

DELORES: Well on my right side I had no feeling from my neck down, the left side from my waist down.

SID: And there is no reversal for this surgery.

DELORES: No.

SID: Never in the history of the world has it ever been reversed until that night when she went to the Kathryn Kuhlman meeting. Now Delores loved God, but did not believe in miracles for today. She felt they ceased. And so when the mother of the housekeeper turned on this Kathryn Kuhlman show, what did you say to her?

DELORES: Turn it off.

SID: Why?

DELORES: Because I came from Pennsylvania. I was always told Kathryn Kuhlman was a kook, said she healed people and that wasn’t true, and I believed it.

SID: And what did the housekeeper’s mother say to you?

DELORES: She said to me, “What is it you’re keeping your door closed to God?” And I had to respond because at that point I was waiting for an answer from God for my youngest son.

SID: You see, she had a young son, how old was he, Chris?

DELORES: He was 14.

SID: He was 14 and she was wondering what was going to happen to him when she died, because, well tell me about the orthopedic doctor that was a friend of yours when he told you, you were going to die. What did he say?

DELORES: Well when he came into the room they wanted to take me into the hospital one more time to see if there was anything they missed or anything they could still do, or anything they could learn to help somebody else. And when they did all this checking and had a new neurosurgeon in to look at me, and he said, “It’s time to go.” The tissues in my back were shredding even, where that bone was through the skin and they couldn’t even patch it. And he came in and sat down and I said, “What’s wrong?” And he said, “Delores, there’s nothing more we can do.” And he said, “I would give anything in this world to make you well, and there’s nothing to be done.”

SID: And she heard the voice of the Holy Spirit say to her, “Kathryn Kuhlman”. And she knew somehow that if she went to the Kathryn Kuhlman meeting she would find out, she’d have some peace of mind of what would happen to her son.

DELORES: That’s right.

SID: You literally said, you had chutzpah; you said to God, what did you say to Him?

DELORES: I told him, “I will not die until You show me how You’re going to take care of Chris.” And He gave him to us. He’s adopted. And He gave him to us after I was in my first body cast and then in a brace for several years.

SID: So did Chris ever see you normal?

DELORES: No, no, he never did. He never did.

SID: Okay. So you know you have to go to this meeting of this woman you don’t care for.

DELORES: But you know, I could go because it was a Methodist Spirit, Holy Spirit Conference, and I grew up Methodist, and I knew they weren’t going to let her do anything out of order.

SID: Okay. So you get in the car to go to this conference. You get out, but you can’t get out of the car yourself. So what do you do?

DELORES: Well Gail always put me in and took me out. And she couldn’t get me out because the pain, the shoulder was deteriorated also, both wrists and all my fingers.

SID: What was going on with your organs?

DELORES: Heart and lungs were very bad, and my kidneys, they started to close off and that was what was killing me. And this man stepped up and said, “Let me help.” He reached in and picked me up and took me in. Gail parked the car and came in, and he took us to seats. And Kathryn Kuhlman came out on stage and I thought, dear God, I can’t stand to look at her. And the Lord said, “You don’t need to look at her. Just listen.” And so I closed my eyes and I was holding my head like this, and she said, “Tonight I’m going to introduce you to the Holy Spirit.” Now she’s talking to Methodist pastors and lay leaders.

SID: It wasn’t a healing service.

DELORES: No, it was not a healing service. In fact, they made her send her people home because they couldn’t have healing. And so I thought, I know the Holy Spirit. It’s the Spirit of God. And she said, “If you call Him it you don’t know Him.” And suddenly something happened to me and I had my eyes closed, and I saw a little Kodak slide picture of Chris and a man on our front porch. And the man turned and looked at me and said, “Tell Chris he need never walk in the house alone, to tell him to take Jesus’ hand and walk in and I’ll walk in with him. But my name is Holy Spirit.”

SID: And now you felt you had your answer.

DELORES: I had my answer. I was ready to go home.

SID: She was ready to die. But God wasn’t ready for her to die. I know you’re not going to go away. We’ll be right back after this word.

SID: My guest, John McTernan, says that he sees a direct connection between 9/11, and the U.S., and the way the U.S. handles Israel. What is that?

JOHN: Well Sid, I just want to refresh your viewers memories that we’re talking about 50 or 60 or 70 same day events, or things happening around the same day regarding the United States pressuring Israel. So 9/11 is not just isolated.

SID: In other words, within 24 hours usually, or even the exact moment, when something bad happens to America, since 1991, John has documented there’s a direct correlation with our handling of Israel. So, continue.

JOHN: So just prior to 9/11, within a week prior to 9/11, and the information I’m relaying to you comes from information that the White House released and picked up by the national newspapers. The President’s formulated policy towards Israel was a two state policy, in that on September 13th, Secretary of State (at that time) Powell was going to notify the Saudi Arabian Ambassador that we were going to unilaterally recognize a Palestinian state, and that was going to be announced at the general assembly of the United Nations on September 23rd, 2001. So 9/11 occurred right at the very time we were going to unilaterally recognize a Palestinian state, and 9/11 put the brakes on it. And we, then, became at war with the same terrorists. I don’t see much difference between the Palestinian terrorists and Osama bin-Laden. I seen the same bedfellows there. We are at war now with the same enemies that Israel is at war with – literally we are at war.

SID: You know, in your book, I think it is absolutely amazing, as you trace two countries that are similar: the United States of America, and Russia, the former Soviet Union, and how one country went against the Jew and what happened to them, and the other country blessed the Jew and what happened to them. Would you explain?

JOHN: Sid, it’s really quite an analogy, where the Jews were being driven out of Russia simply because they were Jewish. The Russians were doing every conceivable thing to drive them out. The only country in the world – now we’re talking starting in 1881, Sid – the only country in the world who would accept them was the United States. All of Europe closed the doors, whoever else closed the doors. The United States opens the door wide, and however many Jews came out of Russia, we accepted. Eventually it was somewhere between 2 or 3 million Jews fled Russia and came to the United States. But in my book, I document, starting in 1881, God began to raise us up as a world power.

SID: So you can pinpoint it?

JOHN: You can pinpoint it to the year, Sid. To the very year. Isn’t that amazing? As we accepted the Jews into our country, God began to raise us up as a world power, and I show it, almost year by year, this parallel.

SID: Now what happened to Russia when they did these things?

JOHN: Sid, I want to speak briefly on what’s called the May Laws of 1883. And it was draconian laws that the Russian government, backed by the Russian Orthodox Church, applied on the Jewish people. For example, they were only allowed to live in a small section of Russia. If they were outside that, they lost their property, they lost their business, they lost their land – at gunpoint – and they were driven into this section. They lived in small, little enclaves. Their businesses would be stolen from them. Their kids couldn’t go to school. They couldn’t worship Judaism. They lived in terror. And then the pogroms started, which is organized assaults on the Jewish people. And I believe that when you look at what the Russian people did to the Jewish people, that communism was nothing more than the May Laws of 1883 applied to all of Russia. Now, the Russian Orthodox Church couldn’t worship. Like they were doing to the Jews, it hit the Russian Orthodox Church.

SID: It’s like the law of sowing and reaping. As they were evil to the Jews, they reaped evil.

JOHN: One generation later, it came on them. If you can think of Russia and Stalin and Lenin, how they would uproot whole bunches of people and move them, send them to Siberia, that’s exactly what they did to the Jewish people, Sid. Their land, you couldn’t own land in Russia. Land was stolen from people. The Jewish people, their land was stolen from them. So I look at communism, one aspect of it, is punishment. You bless the Jew, America was blessed. You curse the Jew, the Russians got communism. And communism was nothing more than the May Laws of 1883 applied to the whole nation.

SID: Well, here we are now, the United States of America. As far as I’m concerned, one of the greatest countries the world has ever known. But John, you say in your book we’re at a crossroads. What do you mean?

JOHN: Sid, the American government, and specifically the Presidency, and I’m not getting into Democrat or Republican because it was the same under the Democrats as it is under Republicans, we are interfering with God’s prophetic plan, like we had mentioned before about Gaza. And God, in His mercy, is trying to bring this to our attention. He’s trying to wake the church, Sid, because it’s really on our shoulders here. We need power from the church, we need intercession from the church, we need prayer from the church.

SID: Alright, what’s going to happen if we continue fostering a two state solution in the Middle East, to the United States?

JOHN: God will break our back, Sid. It’ll either be… I don’t know exactly how He’s going to do it, there’s several ways that are indicated by these warning judgments, but we will no longer be a world power. He will force us to stop interfering with Israel. It’s a matter of how severe the judgment will fall, Sid. There’s no doubt our back will be broken here. We can no longer interfere.

SID: One minute – look in the camera, talk to President Bush. What would you say to him?

JOHN: President Bush, please stop interfering with the affairs of Israel. Bless Israel. Stand with Israel to support Israel if it’s attacked by Ahmadinejad, for example, of Iran. But no longer interfere with the integrity of the nation of Israel.

SID: Do you believe that there is teeth behind that threat of Iran?

JOHN: There is no doubt about it Sid, absolutely no doubt about it. They will attack when the have the capability of doing it. No doubt.

SID: So what would you advise President Bush to do right now, in reference to Iran?

JOHN: Well he’s already told Iran that if they attack Israel that we will defend Israel. The President has said that, March of last year, which is a tremendous thing to say. No other nation in the world would dare say that. That’s the dichotomy in the United States.

SID: Listen, here’s what I believe. I believe we’re buying time. And I want as much time as possible here in the United States. I want this to be the land of the brave and the land of the free. I want it to be a place for Jewish people to be free. I’m Jewish. I also happen to be a Russian Jew, so I’m very grateful to the United States of America. But I say this to you, that one day, according to the Bible, every Jew will end up in Israel. But the problem is, the safest place in the world is not the United States, for a Jew. The safest place in the world is not Israel, for a Jew. There’s only one safe place for a Jew, and that is intimacy with God. There’s only one way to have intimacy with God. There’s only one God, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. There is only one Messiah, not a Messiah for the Jews and a Messiah for the Gentiles. There’s only one Covenant. Jewish people already have the correct Covenant. It’s called the New Covenant. It’s found in Jeremiah 31:31. Gentiles are grafted in to the new Jewish Covenant found in Jeremiah 31:31. When someone tells God they’re sorry for their sins, (that’s called repentance), and asks God to forgive them in the name of the Jewish Messiah, Jesus – Yeshua – and believes that He separated their sins from them and took them on Himself, and boldly proclaims “Yeshua’s my Messiah and Lord”, then you are under the New Covenant, you have intimacy with God, and there could not be a safer place than in the arms of Yeshua.

SID: Unbelievable, I mean Randy Clark goes to this little store front church in Toronto Canada and in the next few years 3 million people go through, was it 3 million that went through?

RANDY: Just in the 1st few years.

SID: In the first few years? This little storefront church?

RANDY: From all over the world.

SID: I want you to pick one person that came there that you prayed for that you received and impartation, that’s why I’m so excited about your book, There Must be More, because this book you actually pray for impartations, you got your greatest impartations from just teaching, understanding how these things operate. Do you wish that you had this information when you started?

RANDY: It would have been invaluable.

SID: I wish I had this information when I started. So tell me about one of my favorite people, you know I have a lot of favorite people that you prayed for and the whole world turned upside down in a good way. Tell us about Heidi and Roland Baker, tell me about Heidi Baker.

RANDY: Well I was preaching a sermon on impartation.

SID: Just like in here.

RANDY: It’s in there. The basis of it. And she can’t wait till it’s over, she runs in the middle of it to the front and when I see her on her knees crying I actually had a strong impression from the Lord God and I said Heidi God wants to know if you want the nation of Mozambique and she said yes. Now she’s a burned out missionary and that’s a ridiculous question to ask and it was ridiculous that she would say yes but then I heard myself say God is going to give you the nation of Mozambique and you’ll se the blind see, the deaf here, the lame walk and the dead will be raised.

SID: Now wait a second, there’s a lot of responsibility you saying something like that. Doesn’t, don’t you kind of tremble of maybe it’s just my ideas? Come on, between you and me.

RANDY: That was so strong that you say it before you think about the consequences of it.

SID: I see, you had a mind bypass.

RANDY: It really was. You know Heidi and I have laughed about it. We’re both crazy because it’s so illogical that that would ever happen from a little burned out missionary with a small little church.

SID: How many churches had she started since in Mozambique?

RANDY: Seven. She and her husband, well one in Mozambique, seven in her lifetime.

SID: Let’s fast forward right now. How many churches has she started now?

RANDY: Over 7,000.

SID: Did you say 7000? In how long a period of time?

RANDY: Seven years, and approximately 1,000,000 people have come to the Lord through Jesus Christ through there.

SID: Through impartation through this one person?

RANDY: Well it multiplied. What happened to her lasted 7 days and 7 nights and the power of God hit her, heat, electricity and energy and she heard the voice of God and went into visions and everything. But then when she went back to Mozambique she gathered 12 men together and God said now everything Randy prophesied to you, he prophesied to them and she spoke to them the same words and the Word of God came on to them too. And then they went out and that was the instant multiplication and it’s continuing, they lay hands on people and pray for them and they begin to move in gifts.

SID: Now she, how many orphans does she have?

RANDY: There’s over 1000 in the 2 orphanages but every church they start are to have an orphanage and the pastor is to adopt children into his own personal family, in every church.

SID: Now listen this is not just religion that you may be used to, there’s Judaism, Christianity, Islam, this is the same thing we read about in the new covenant, that Jesus did, the identical things. For instance, any dead people coming back to life under Heidi’s ministry of the 12 people she prayed for?

RANDY: Through their ministry at this point, I think 54 now, most of them in the Muslim territories.

SID: Now of these 54 were they dead for a few seconds or a few minutes?

RANDY: You know I forgot Sid exactly what it is but they have to be dead for several hours before they’ll count it and they have to live for a year after they’ve been raised before they’ll count it. And I’ve interviewed them. One of my hobbies is to interview people who raise the dead.

SID: Did you ever talk to any that had some sort of experience when they died? And talked about it. I mean as far as seeing Jesus or something like that.

RANDY: I can’t think right now.

SID: That’s what I want to know. What did you see? I mean everyone is going to die. You can’t avoid it. So I’d like to know what these people have seen. Wouldn’t you? Ok.

RANDY: I don’t remember the stories of that because I’m usually asking questions to the people that are praying for them because I want to see this begin to happen in my ministry and other peoples ministries. But it effects, it is one of the main reasons for so many Muslims coming to the Lord in the Northern provinces, just seeing people being raised from the dead. They went into an area where they had been for 25 years and had only 25 converts and within the 1st year they had over 200 churches started I believe and I was there and I’m getting ready to go over there in a few days, and they have 5 or 600 people baptized in the Indian Ocean every month. Coming out of
Islam because of seeing the miracles in Jesus name.

SID: Now there’s another man that I interviewed that you prayed for and all of the sudden he can see into the invisible world. I mean all of the sudden this fellow can literally find out what’s going on in heaven and become like an actor, act it out on earth, and if it’s already happened in heaven…

RANDY: We have teenagers that have gone with us once a year, a big youth thing, 13 to 29 year olds, and I know several teenagers that have had that same, that happened to Gary, it’s going on in their life including my pastor’s 17 year old son.

SID: In your book you have the prayer for impartation and my personal spin right now Randy is teaching is as important as impartation, you have both in this book but if you are hungering and thirsting for reality, if you’ve tried religion and its ok, it’s nice, friends, social, and there are a lot of nice things involved in religion, a lot of bad things too for that matter. But there’s something so much bigger, something so much better, it’s intimacy with God. I mean if you know the truth no one can ever take that from you wherever you are, there’s more. In fact that’s the title of the book, There is More. Randy would you pray for this impartation, meaning the same type of gifting he has and even greater he is going to pray upon you right now.

RANDY: Alright. Well you may begin to feel something, if you do don’t try to stop it and don’t be afraid, it’s just the spirit of God coming on you whether it’s heat or energy or you begin to cry, just go with it. Father you know the ones that are hungry, you know the ones that are wanting this in their life, you know the ones who are believing for it so I just bless them in the name of Jesus and I ask for heaven to become real to them, for the spirit of God to come upon them, for angels of God to be assigned to them, to work with them. I bless them, I pray God that the gifts of the word of knowledge, the gift of prophecy would begin to happen in their life, that they would no what others were feeling and they would feel others pain, so I bless them and I pray for Your power to flow into their body, your power to flow into their mind. I pray that you would make them a blessing because you’ve blessed them. I pray for this power to flow out of them, when they pray for people that they would feel as Paul said, energy flowing into them. In Jesus name Lord we bless them and we expect to here great testimonies of how you used them because you’re no respecter of persons. Father we’ve seen you touch all types of people and Lord even if there’s someone there now that needs to be healed, would you touch them? Heal them, let them feel your power in Jesus name; glorify his name Father by healing them. Amen.

SID: I don’t know what’s going on with you but I can just tell you as a reporter what’s going on with me. Randy I am felling such supernatural peace. It’s almost like what you described happened to you. Now I’m not going through a nervous break down of fortunately but I’m feeling this peace. What does this peace mean? I believe this peace means the presence of God has invaded you. I believe this peace means that you are ready to walk into the most extraordinary adventure of your life. Remember he prayed in the name of Yeshua, Hebrew for Jesus. Give him the credit for this miracle.

SID: Sid Roth here with Randy Clark. We found out that all of the sudden there was an activation of the supernatural in his life. He started hearing words right in, Randy would you say when you would here these words were they more thoughts of were they like audible words or how did it operate?

RANDY: Well of the 5 different ways that I was told that you could receive them, I move primarily in the 1st one which is I would feel them in my body. I know exactly what it felt, I new exactly where it was, I could describe the pain and if I did get it that way, I was 90 percent accurate. If I had an impression I was 25 percent accurate so I leaned for years into that strength and did not develop the other. I was in my 30s then and now that I’m in my 50s I’m having to develop the impression side because I’m getting more of my own pain.

SID: Now when you have the impressions are you now getting the same results as when you had the pain?

RANDY: Yes, and I’m getting better at discerning the difference because at first I was just so accurate with when I felt them I just didn’t develop this other side by trial and error and now it’s much more accurate.

SID: Ok, look, I am fascinated at this meeting that you went to because I know this man; I interviewed him before anyone had ever heard of him in America. His name is Rodney Howard Brown. You went to his meeting because you were just plain desperate for a taste of God but you wanted what you had previously tasted but you wanted more and so I understand you were fasting, you were seeking God, you down to this meeting and he puts his hand on you, fire, lightening, Moses, what happened?

RANDY: It was actually different because in the earlier impartation I received, a guy prayed for me. Actually he didn’t even touch me, he prayed from the platform. I felt fire, electricity, shook…

SID: Were you scared?

RANDY: Yes, because I had never felt more than tears. When I feel Gods love I get teary eyed but I never felt power like that and that was scary and then in 89, that was 84, in 89 I had an experience where I was afraid that I was going to die, the power was so strong that I literally was fearful that I was going to die.

SID: Did you ask God to stop the power?

RANDY: No, I knew I didn’t want to ask him to stop but I said God you’re scaring me, I don’t think you want to kill me but are you aware that if you turn up the power, I am afraid that you’re going too. But this was the summer of 93 and I was expecting a similarity to that.

SID: Why?

RANDY: but it didn’t happen. I just fell down, I couldn’t stand up anymore and I thought that this is just a psychological suggestion because I don’t feel and electricity, I don’t feel any power or any heat or any energy. But when I tried to get up I couldn’t. I could move my head and that was it. And I got prayed for by him about five times in 24 hours and what I did feel was tremendous peace. Now I was on the verge of a nervous breakdown when I went and so what happened is that I received an impartation of peace and also joy. Uncontrollable laughter at one of the events.

SID: And so you are telling me that it was hard to be depressed with all of this peace that had invaded you?

RANDY: It was amazing and the things that I continue to do that had caused me to be so stressed out and now I added on to it another full time job so it is double what I had, double the stress, but I’m not stressed. I’m walking like in this bubble of peace.

SID: But you told that you could not physically get off the ground once you were down. Did you try?

RANDY: Yes.

SID: And what would happen?

RANDY: You just felt like a tremendous weight was on me and I realized that there had been in the things of God enough to know that I shouldn’t resist this, I should yield to it.

SID: But if you had resisted so you think that you could have just got up?

RANDY: Not the 1st one, the others I could, it was different, the other 4 times he prayed for me I couldn’t stand up but I could have quicker. The 1st time I was probably there a long time.

SID: Ok, your 1st meeting after you get back, what happened to the people in front of you?

RANDY: All heaven broke loose.

SID: What do you mean?

RANDY: People had never fallen down when I prayed for them in the 8 year history of the church and then every person we prayed for would.

SID: What causes them to fall down?

RANDY: They can’t stand up.

SID: Well that’s the logical thing but what is it that puts them down?

RANDY: The presence of God. One of the words for the Glory of God is weight and there’s such comes on you and some people fall forward and some people fall backwards.

SID: The Hebrew word is kavode which means heaviness. That is exactly what you are saying.

RANDY: It is a heaviness that comes and you can resist it. You know I tell people don’t fall down on purpose, that’s the flesh, but tighten up all the muscles in your body to try to keep standing up when this heaviness comes, just be like a sail in the wind. Don’t try to fall and don’t try to stand. Let God show you how to receive from him. So that’s really been helpful. It was very helpful for me because I would always bend over doubled trying to keep standing up when this weight would come.

SID: So people fell down, so what? What else happened?

RANDY: A lot of inner healing, a lot of healing of emotional stuff.

SID: Like what happened to you.

RANDY: Yeah but even more. People like for example, I don’t want to jump on you here but recently I was in Rochester New York and I spoke at a school, a private school, kindergarteners through seniors in high school, quite the challenge to hold their attention but God came, Third graders just weeping on their face before God, but their was a teacher there from, she was a Christian but she had never been aware of any of these types of phenomena that can occur and we didn’t even pray for her but the Spirit of God came while we were talking and she began to feel this heat in her hands and got hot all over and began to tremble and she went to one of the other teachers and said I’ve never felt anything like this in my life and she was afraid actually. But even though it was new, that’s where her fear came from, it had never happened before, she went with it. her daughter had been in a mental institution, a psych ward in a hospital for six months and there was no progression in there improvement and the doctor said we don’t know, we don’t have any good word that we can give you about when she is going to get out. Immediately following that meeting at the school she goes to her daughter and is praying for her, I want to pray for you honey, lays hands on her and she starts praying for her daughter, she has never done this before, and the daughter says mom, your hands are extremely hot. Two days later the psychiatrist calls the mother and says we don’t know what’s happened to your daughter because we saw no change for six months and in the last two days there’s been a significant change and he said we project for her to be released from the psych ward on June the 9th.

SID: Listen, you think that’s something? Randy then finds himself in a little storefront church. A tiny little storefront church in Toronto Canada, this same power erupts. People are traveling all over the world now from taking that glory. I’m going to have him pray for that same glory for you. Don’t go away we’ll be right back.